cpu.h and Color Classic/LC 575

[Bryan Vyhmeister]

I am attempting to run OpenBSD/mac68k 3.9 on a Color Classic that has
been upgraded with an LC 575 motherboard and full 68040 but without
the 640x480 video hack. In order to run Mac OS 7.5.5, I had to change
an item in the System file for the Gestalt ID 99 from Boot Process 21
to 10. I get the same bus error in OpenBSD/mac68k that I got with
System 7.5.5 before being patched (it looks different but the error
is the same). Any idea if modifying sys/arch/mac68k/include/cpu.h to
read Gestalt 99 instead of 92 for the LC 575 would have any effect? I
would just try it and rebuild the kernel but that takes a very long
time so I thought I would ask first before I try it.

Bryan

[Martin Reindl]

Post by Bryan Vyhmeister
I am attempting to run OpenBSD/mac68k 3.9 on a Color Classic that has
been upgraded with an LC 575 motherboard and full 68040 but without
the 640x480 video hack. In order to run Mac OS 7.5.5, I had to change
an item in the System file for the Gestalt ID 99 from Boot Process 21
to 10. I get the same bus error in OpenBSD/mac68k that I got with
System 7.5.5 before being patched (it looks different but the error
is the same). Any idea if modifying sys/arch/mac68k/include/cpu.h to
read Gestalt 99 instead of 92 for the LC 575 would have any effect? I
would just try it and rebuild the kernel but that takes a very long
time so I thought I would ask first before I try it.

Hard to say without knowing the exact error. You can try and just build
a kernel overnight.

[Miod Vallat]

Post by Martin Reindl

Post by Bryan Vyhmeister
I am attempting to run OpenBSD/mac68k 3.9 on a Color Classic that has
been upgraded with an LC 575 motherboard and full 68040 but without
the 640x480 video hack. In order to run Mac OS 7.5.5, I had to change
an item in the System file for the Gestalt ID 99 from Boot Process 21
to 10. I get the same bus error in OpenBSD/mac68k that I got with
System 7.5.5 before being patched (it looks different but the error
is the same). Any idea if modifying sys/arch/mac68k/include/cpu.h to
read Gestalt 99 instead of 92 for the LC 575 would have any effect? I
would just try it and rebuild the kernel but that takes a very long
time so I thought I would ask first before I try it.

Hard to say without knowing the exact error. You can try and just build
a kernel overnight.

From a code point of view, LC575 (Gestalt 92) and Performa 580 (Gestalt 99)
are completely identical (except for the machine description string), so
this will hardly change anything.

Miod

[Bryan Vyhmeister]

Post by Miod Vallat
From a code point of view, LC575 (Gestalt 92) and Performa 580
(Gestalt 99)
are completely identical (except for the machine description
string), so
this will hardly change anything.

I wondered about that. Any idea what "boot process" would have to do
with in relation to OpenBSD? The details of what I had to do to get
Mac OS 7.5.5 to run are here:

http://www.colourclassicfaq.com/mobo/mystic.shtml

Bryan

[Joel Rees]

Post by Bryan Vyhmeister

Post by Miod Vallat
From a code point of view, LC575 (Gestalt 92) and Performa 580 (Gestalt 99)
are completely identical (except for the machine description
string), so
this will hardly change anything.

I wondered about that. Any idea what "boot process" would have to
do with in relation to OpenBSD?

Could you unpack that question a little?

Post by Bryan Vyhmeister
http://www.colourclassicfaq.com/mobo/mystic.shtml

Man, I wish I had that much time on my hands, not to mention the
space for old hardware, and the apparently cheap electricity.

While we're at it, let's try to port obsd to the old 6809. ;->

It would appear from your site that you have a spare old Mac. If you
have a printer cable and an old copy of ClarisWorks (was bundled with
many of the consumer Macs), there's a sort of decent terminal
emulator in ClarisWorks. (I don't remember if there was a terminal
emulator in AppleWorks 5.) That would allow you to capture the error
messages and other relevant output during boot without having to
filter it through your eyeballs and fingertips. (Hint, hint.)

(Hint. Hint.)

[Allen Briggs]

Post by Joel Rees
It would appear from your site that you have a spare old Mac. If you
have a printer cable and an old copy of ClarisWorks (was bundled with
many of the consumer Macs), there's a sort of decent terminal
emulator in ClarisWorks.

There's also ZTerm, which I think was freeware or maybe low-cost
shareware back in the 68k's heydays. Serial consoles are invaluable.

-allen

[Bryan Vyhmeister]

Post by Joel Rees
Man, I wish I had that much time on my hands, not to mention the
space for old hardware, and the apparently cheap electricity.
While we're at it, let's try to port obsd to the old 6809. ;->
It would appear from your site that you have a spare old Mac. If
you have a printer cable and an old copy of ClarisWorks (was
bundled with many of the consumer Macs), there's a sort of decent
terminal emulator in ClarisWorks. (I don't remember if there was a
terminal emulator in AppleWorks 5.) That would allow you to capture
the error messages and other relevant output during boot without
having to filter it through your eyeballs and fingertips. (Hint,
hint.)

I get the hint. I need to set that up but I haven't had a chance to
yet. The Color Classic/LC 575 is running great so far since I used
BSD/mac68k Booter 2.0.0 (which I noticed is used in OpenBSD 4.0) and
set the Machine ID to 92.

Bryan

[Bryan Vyhmeister]

Post by Martin Reindl

Post by Bryan Vyhmeister
I am attempting to run OpenBSD/mac68k 3.9 on a Color Classic that has
been upgraded with an LC 575 motherboard and full 68040 but without
the 640x480 video hack. In order to run Mac OS 7.5.5, I had to change
an item in the System file for the Gestalt ID 99 from Boot Process 21
to 10. I get the same bus error in OpenBSD/mac68k that I got with
System 7.5.5 before being patched (it looks different but the error
is the same). Any idea if modifying sys/arch/mac68k/include/cpu.h to
read Gestalt 99 instead of 92 for the LC 575 would have any effect? I
would just try it and rebuild the kernel but that takes a very long
time so I thought I would ask first before I try it.

Hard to say without knowing the exact error. You can try and just build
a kernel overnight.

I will try it but I have to get src mounted using NFS and all first.
I'll try to get it done today.

Bryan

[Martin Reindl]

Post by Bryan Vyhmeister

Post by Martin Reindl

Post by Bryan Vyhmeister
I am attempting to run OpenBSD/mac68k 3.9 on a Color Classic that has
been upgraded with an LC 575 motherboard and full 68040 but without
the 640x480 video hack. In order to run Mac OS 7.5.5, I had to change
an item in the System file for the Gestalt ID 99 from Boot Process 21
to 10. I get the same bus error in OpenBSD/mac68k that I got with
System 7.5.5 before being patched (it looks different but the error
is the same). Any idea if modifying sys/arch/mac68k/include/cpu.h to
read Gestalt 99 instead of 92 for the LC 575 would have any effect? I
would just try it and rebuild the kernel but that takes a very long
time so I thought I would ask first before I try it.

Hard to say without knowing the exact error. You can try and just build
a kernel overnight.

I will try it but I have to get src mounted using NFS and all first.
I'll try to get it done today.
Bryan

Don't bother, see Miod's previous mail. Please provide the full error
message instead.

[Bryan Vyhmeister]

Hmm... I thought this list was dead and gone. Bryan, hope you
aren't expecting a response from anyone else trying to run OpenBSD
on old Macs like a Color Classic. This distribution has stopped
supporting that machine (PDS slot ethernet) and the likes of my
Powerbook 180 a long time ago.
Much more support for old mac68k iron over at NetBSD.

I understand. I prefer OpenBSD. I have tried running NetBSD recently
and I have had a number of issues with stability. Those have not been
the case with OpenBSD in my experience so I would prefer to stick
with it. Note that this machine is not really a Color Classic anymore
from the logic board point of view but actually an LC 575. I'm not
sure what the bus error relates to exactly but I am going to try to
figure it out.

I recognize it is not supported but I am running OpenBSD/mac68k 3.9
on an SE/30 right now and it runs fine aside from the fact it is very
slow because of the 16 MHz 68030. The shell is sluggish but isn't bad
except for very slow initial login with ssh.

Bryan

[Bryan Vyhmeister]

You got me curious now. How do you plan to connect your machine to
a network? The serial cable/null modem route? Or, is there an se0
driver in OpenBSD that would support the old Cabletron EA4-- series
SCSI-ethernet adaptors?

Both the SE/30 and Color Classic/LC 575 have 10base-T ethernet
installed using an expansion board. The LC 575 board is using the LC
PDS Nubus slot (I think that is what it is called) and I don't
remember what slot the SE/30 is using but it works fine. The LC 575
comes up with an sn0 interface and the SE/30 with an ae0 interface.

Bryan

[Thomas Carlson]

Hmm... I thought this list was dead and gone. Bryan, hope you aren't
expecting a response from anyone else trying to run OpenBSD on old Macs
like a Color Classic. This distribution has stopped supporting that
machine (PDS slot ethernet) and the likes of my Powerbook 180 a long
time ago.

Much more support for old mac68k iron over at NetBSD.

Tom

Post by Bryan Vyhmeister
I am attempting to run OpenBSD/mac68k 3.9 on a Color Classic that has
been upgraded with an LC 575 motherboard and full 68040 but without
the 640x480 video hack. In order to run Mac OS 7.5.5, I had to change
an item in the System file for the Gestalt ID 99 from Boot Process 21
to 10. I get the same bus error in OpenBSD/mac68k that I got with
System 7.5.5 before being patched (it looks different but the error is
the same). Any idea if modifying sys/arch/mac68k/include/cpu.h to read
Gestalt 99 instead of 92 for the LC 575 would have any effect? I would
just try it and rebuild the kernel but that takes a very long time so
I thought I would ask first before I try it.
Bryan

[Bryan Vyhmeister]

Thank you for all the replies. In searching around on the NetBSD/
mac68k list archives, I found a post related to this precise issue. I
installed the BSD/mac68k Booter version 2.0 from NetBSD and in the
settings, you can manually change the machine ID. I changed it from
99 to 92. Now it is booting just fine. I am attempting to install
now. I will post more later on how it goes.

Bryan

[Miod Vallat]

Post by Thomas Carlson
Hmm... I thought this list was dead and gone. Bryan, hope you aren't
expecting a response from anyone else trying to run OpenBSD on old Macs
like a Color Classic. This distribution has stopped supporting that
machine (PDS slot ethernet) and the likes of my Powerbook 180 a long
time ago.
Much more support for old mac68k iron over at NetBSD.

I disagree.

While the main focus of OpenBSD/mac68k is on fast 68030 and 68040
machines, there has been a lot of work over the last 12-18 months to
bring the mac68k port back in a very good shape.

However, PowerBooks and systems with IDE disks are not being worked on,
mainly because of a lack of hardware rather than because of a lack of
interest (anyone got a spare PowerBook 550c ?). This does not mean they
don't work to a decent level.

As for ``old iron'' used on a mac... this sounds like an oxymoron to
me (-:

Miod

[Bryan Vyhmeister]

Post by Miod Vallat
While the main focus of OpenBSD/mac68k is on fast 68030 and 68040
machines, there has been a lot of work over the last 12-18 months to
bring the mac68k port back in a very good shape.

I'm really glad to hear that! The reality of it is, these machines
can still be useful and it is great to be able to run a world-class
operating system on them. I enjoy it and I know others do too. It's fun.

Post by Miod Vallat
However, PowerBooks and systems with IDE disks are not being worked on,
mainly because of a lack of hardware rather than because of a lack of
interest (anyone got a spare PowerBook 550c ?). This does not mean they
don't work to a decent level.

IDE support wouldn't be a priority in my list because SCSI works
better especially with slow machines because of its greater
intelligence so to speak. As for PowerBook support, I've been trying
to get my hands on a PowerBook 550c for years now. I have a regular
search running on eBay and nothing has turned up for a very long
time. I tried to find one using other sources too and one person said
he was going to sell his and then I never heard from him again. I
assume he decided not to sell or found another buyer. I don't know.

Post by Miod Vallat
As for ``old iron'' used on a mac... this sounds like an oxymoron to

I agree completely!! Thanks for your comments. They are very
encouraging.

Bryan

[Thomas Carlson]

Post by Miod Vallat

Post by Thomas Carlson
Hmm... I thought this list was dead and gone. Bryan, hope you aren't
expecting a response from anyone else trying to run OpenBSD on old Macs
like a Color Classic. This distribution has stopped supporting that
machine (PDS slot ethernet) and the likes of my Powerbook 180 a long
time ago.
Much more support for old mac68k iron over at NetBSD.

I disagree.
While the main focus of OpenBSD/mac68k is on fast 68030 and 68040
machines, there has been a lot of work over the last 12-18 months to
bring the mac68k port back in a very good shape.

That's good to hear. OpenBSD was always a bit smug about not including
ethernet drivers and the like for the older, more limited hardware. To
be smug about one's Quadra... that must seem hilarious to anyone from
outside the mac68k community who wonders why we are bothering with any
of this old junk to begin with.

Post by Miod Vallat
However, PowerBooks and systems with IDE disks are not being worked on,
mainly because of a lack of hardware rather than because of a lack of
interest (anyone got a spare PowerBook 550c ?). This does not mean they
don't work to a decent level.

Actually, most older PowerBooks, my 180 included, are SCSI, not IDE. I
am using a 1.3 GIG SCSI converted ATA drive that works just fine with
NetBSD 1.5.3. The biggest limitation these old 'books have, other than
the 14MB RAM limit, is that the only way they can be connected to a
network is through a serial port or a SCSI-ethernet adapter such as the
Cabletron EA414 I have. NetBSD has an se0 driver for it included in
their generic kernel, but I have yet to figure out how to get the
device to work.

Post by Miod Vallat
As for ``old iron'' used on a mac... this sounds like an oxymoron to

I was being ironic, pardon the pun.

Post by Miod Vallat
Miod